Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ?
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Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ?
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Guest
Posted: Sun Feb 27, 2005 7:55 am    Post subject: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
Hi,

I don't understand why DELL is unwilling to sell AMD64 products. Steve
Felice, VP @ DELl says their is no customers demand for AMD64. Suck to
be Steve. From various Linux flavors to BSD, the OSs rock on AMD64
macs. I have conformance test suite benchmarks which are better on
AMD64 than on f**ing Itanium.

I feel this is a ridiculous policy @ DELL not to sell AMD products.
Anyone in FTC listening ?

Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.

Thanks.
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Guest
Posted: Sun Feb 27, 2005 7:55 am    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
I would suggest that you put your frustration on something more
important.
Take a walk and calm down.

AMD is doing pretty good even without Dell, and I don't think Dell is
unwilling to sell AMD64 products since Intel's x86-64 chips are
compatible with AMD64. As I see it, AMD has a performance advantage in
4-way servers (that advantage is dwindling with the new IBM chipset),
the difference in 1-2 way is negliable, they do however currently have
a lower power usage. These things change from year to year, in 2006
Intel may have an advantage, and then it makes no sense for Dell to
upset a solid supplier.
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CJT
Guest
Posted: Sun Feb 27, 2005 7:55 am    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
codefixer@gmail.com wrote:
Quote:
Hi,

I don't understand why DELL is unwilling to sell AMD64 products. Steve
Felice, VP @ DELl says their is no customers demand for AMD64. Suck to
be Steve. From various Linux flavors to BSD, the OSs rock on AMD64
macs. I have conformance test suite benchmarks which are better on
AMD64 than on f**ing Itanium.

I feel this is a ridiculous policy @ DELL not to sell AMD products.
Anyone in FTC listening ?

Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.

Thanks.

You don't _have_ to buy Dell, you know...


--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form che...@prodigy.net.
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Terje Mathisen
Guest
Posted: Sun Feb 27, 2005 8:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
icerq4a@spray.se wrote:
Quote:
I would suggest that you put your frustration on something more
important.
Take a walk and calm down.

AMD is doing pretty good even without Dell, and I don't think Dell is
unwilling to sell AMD64 products since Intel's x86-64 chips are
compatible with AMD64. As I see it, AMD has a performance advantage in
4-way servers (that advantage is dwindling with the new IBM chipset),
the difference in 1-2 way is negliable, they do however currently have
a lower power usage. These things change from year to year, in 2006
Intel may have an advantage, and then it makes no sense for Dell to
upset a solid supplier.

Even more important (at least for Dell?) might be the fact that even if
Dell got AMD's entire output, it still wouldn't be enough (afaik) to
fill all the boxes they sell.

I.e. they would then have to support dual configurations, which would
almost certainly be more costly.

OTOH, they obviously love to have AMD as an at least partly believable
threath when going into negotiations with Intel. :-)

Terje
--
- <Terje.Mathisen@hda.hydro.com>
"almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"
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Terje Mathisen
Guest
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:55 am    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
Greg Lindahl wrote:
Quote:
In article <cvsnv2$2dv$1@osl016lin.hda.hydro.com>,
Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@hda.hydro.com> wrote:


Even more important (at least for Dell?) might be the fact that even if
Dell got AMD's entire output, it still wouldn't be enough (afaik) to
fill all the boxes they sell.


Every other large company selling AMD (IBM, HP) doesn't sell only AMD.
I don't know why you think Dell would be different.


I.e. they would then have to support dual configurations, which would
almost certainly be more costly.


Dell already sells a lot of different stuff, which is costly.

I suspect the biggest reason Dell chose to stay with only Intel is
that Intel lowered their prices. Isn't Dell the #1 buyer of Intel
cpus? So a threat to sell AMD is a good way to get a nicer discount.

I think we agree: I.e. Dell _could_ sell both Intel and AMD systems, but
being Intel's largest single client, and at the same time selling only
Intel machines, has to give them a lot of price leverage when negotiating.

You snipped the part where I stated that Dell obviously profits from the
possibility of using AMD, i.e. Intel's prices to Dell would almost
certainly have been higher in a non-competitive market, right?

Terje
--
- <Terje.Mathisen@hda.hydro.com>
"almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"
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Greg Lindahl
Guest
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:55 am    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
In article <cvsnv2$2dv$1@osl016lin.hda.hydro.com>,
Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@hda.hydro.com> wrote:

Quote:
Even more important (at least for Dell?) might be the fact that even if
Dell got AMD's entire output, it still wouldn't be enough (afaik) to
fill all the boxes they sell.

Every other large company selling AMD (IBM, HP) doesn't sell only AMD.
I don't know why you think Dell would be different.

Quote:
I.e. they would then have to support dual configurations, which would
almost certainly be more costly.

Dell already sells a lot of different stuff, which is costly.

I suspect the biggest reason Dell chose to stay with only Intel is
that Intel lowered their prices. Isn't Dell the #1 buyer of Intel
cpus? So a threat to sell AMD is a good way to get a nicer discount.

-- greg
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Bernd Paysan
Guest
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
Terje Mathisen wrote:
Quote:
I think we agree: I.e. Dell _could_ sell both Intel and AMD systems, but
being Intel's largest single client, and at the same time selling only
Intel machines, has to give them a lot of price leverage when negotiating.

Is this for real? Dell *is* Intel's largest single client. How can Intel
possibly be nasty to such a client?

AMD's plan is to ramp up CPU production from 50 million units to 150 million
units in 2006. Now that's probably the kind of supply Dell needs for a
serious threat.

Quote:
You snipped the part where I stated that Dell obviously profits from the
possibility of using AMD, i.e. Intel's prices to Dell would almost
certainly have been higher in a non-competitive market, right?

The possibility is rather academic. If they had actual offerings, they could
add real figures when they discuss with Intel. Intel needs Dell more than
Dell needs Intel (same with Microsoft).

--
Bernd Paysan
"If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
http://www.jwdt.com/~paysan/
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Chris Barts
Guest
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
Bernd Paysan wrote:
Quote:
Terje Mathisen wrote:

I think we agree: I.e. Dell _could_ sell both Intel and AMD systems, but
being Intel's largest single client, and at the same time selling only
Intel machines, has to give them a lot of price leverage when negotiating.


Is this for real? Dell *is* Intel's largest single client. How can Intel
possibly be nasty to such a client?

Heh. If there's no other game in town, you can be as nasty as you want
to anyone. Which is what Terje seems to be hinting at indirectly: Intel
isn't the only game in town, so it's forced to play nice.

Quote:

AMD's plan is to ramp up CPU production from 50 million units to 150 million
units in 2006. Now that's probably the kind of supply Dell needs for a
serious threat.


And given that fact, Intel will probably be nicer and nicer to Dell as
AMD becomes more and more of a threat in that market.

Quote:

You snipped the part where I stated that Dell obviously profits from the
possibility of using AMD, i.e. Intel's prices to Dell would almost
certainly have been higher in a non-competitive market, right?


The possibility is rather academic. If they had actual offerings, they could
add real figures when they discuss with Intel. Intel needs Dell more than
Dell needs Intel (same with Microsoft).


/This/ is the truth. Intel and AMD are competing to sell a commodity:
chips that implement the x86 ISA. If you don't like one, you can hop to
the other without losing your business. (Is anyone else seriously in the
x86 market these days? VIA? Transmeta? Bueller?)
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israel
Guest
Posted: Tue Mar 01, 2005 5:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
CJT <abujlehc@prodigy.net> writes:

Quote:
Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.
Thanks.

You don't _have_ to buy Dell, you know...

In fact I was under the impression that only the mentally challenged bought Dell.
You can get better quality cheaper or far better quality for just a bit more.
Back to top
Sander Vesik
Guest
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2005 12:35 am    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
codefixer@gmail.com wrote:
Quote:
Hi,

I don't understand why DELL is unwilling to sell AMD64 products. Steve
Felice, VP @ DELl says their is no customers demand for AMD64. Suck to
be Steve. From various Linux flavors to BSD, the OSs rock on AMD64
macs. I have conformance test suite benchmarks which are better on
AMD64 than on f**ing Itanium.

I feel this is a ridiculous policy @ DELL not to sell AMD products.
Anyone in FTC listening ?

What has FTC got to do with this?

Quote:

Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.


Vote with your feet and buy from somebody else.

Quote:
Thanks.


--
Sander

+++ Out of cheese error +++
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Kai Harrekilde-Petersen
Guest
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2005 1:52 am    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
israel <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes:

Quote:
CJT <abujlehc@prodigy.net> writes:

Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.
Thanks.

You don't _have_ to buy Dell, you know...

In fact I was under the impression that only the mentally challenged bought Dell.
You can get better quality cheaper or far better quality for just a bit more.

If you're a large corporation, the only players out there are Dell,
HPaq, and IBM - no, wait, IBM is getting out of that business.

So, of these two options, which do you choose?


Kai
--
Kai Harrekilde-Petersen <khp(at)harrekilde(dot)dk>
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Del Cecchi
Guest
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2005 3:26 am    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
Kai Harrekilde-Petersen wrote:
Quote:
israel <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes:


CJT <abujlehc@prodigy.net> writes:


Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.
Thanks.


You don't _have_ to buy Dell, you know...

In fact I was under the impression that only the mentally challenged bought Dell.
You can get better quality cheaper or far better quality for just a bit more.


If you're a large corporation, the only players out there are Dell,
HPaq, and IBM - no, wait, IBM is getting out of that business.

So, of these two options, which do you choose?


Kai
For the next few years you will still be able to buy IBM brand PCs,

including IBM Thinkpads.

del
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Terje Mathisen
Guest
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2005 4:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
Kai Harrekilde-Petersen wrote:
Quote:
israel <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes:


CJT <abujlehc@prodigy.net> writes:


Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.
Thanks.


You don't _have_ to buy Dell, you know...

In fact I was under the impression that only the mentally challenged bought Dell.
You can get better quality cheaper or far better quality for just a bit more.


If you're a large corporation, the only players out there are Dell,
HPaq, and IBM - no, wait, IBM is getting out of that business.

So, of these two options, which do you choose?

Exactly.

We used to buy Compaq, and still buy servers from them with the HP
brand, but PCs have been Dell for some years now.

With 55K employees in 77 countries, and a contract requirement for local
delivery and support, there's _really_ not that many vendors to choose
from. :-(

Terje (who has absolutely nothing to do with PC acquisition these days)
--
- <Terje.Mathisen@hda.hydro.com>
"almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"
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Sander Vesik
Guest
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2005 4:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
Kai Harrekilde-Petersen <khp@harrekilde.dk> wrote:
Quote:
israel <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes:

CJT <abujlehc@prodigy.net> writes:

Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.
Thanks.

You don't _have_ to buy Dell, you know...

In fact I was under the impression that only the mentally challenged bought Dell.
You can get better quality cheaper or far better quality for just a bit more.

If you're a large corporation, the only players out there are Dell,
HPaq, and IBM - no, wait, IBM is getting out of that business.

So, of these two options, which do you choose?

If you only have these two choices while being a large corp, its time to
start an internal investigation into conflicts of intrest among those
responisble for purchases.

Quote:


Kai

--
Sander

+++ Out of cheese error +++
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Alex Gibson
Guest
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2005 5:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Is AMD64 an untouchable at DELL ? Reply with quote
"Kai Harrekilde-Petersen" <khp@harrekilde.dk> wrote in message
news:uhdjv84xv.fsf@harrekilde.dk...
Quote:
israel <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes:

CJT <abujlehc@prodigy.net> writes:

Sorry but I am frustrated by this attitude of DELL and will post this
message on multiple newsgroups.
Thanks.

You don't _have_ to buy Dell, you know...

In fact I was under the impression that only the mentally challenged
bought Dell.
You can get better quality cheaper or far better quality for just a bit
more.

If you're a large corporation, the only players out there are Dell,
HPaq, and IBM - no, wait, IBM is getting out of that business.

So, of these two options, which do you choose?

Apple, a mini mac or imac would make a nice corporate box.
Backed up by a few xserves.

Alex
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