| Author |
Message |
Lewin A.R.W. Edwards
Guest
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 Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 2:06 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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| Quote: | I've never had any problem with the $20 USB->serial interfaces
under Linux. Windows support for them isn't great...
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Which particular ones are you using? All the devices I've used either
don't work with the evbs I need to use, or cause kernel panics sometimes
(I can't work out the exact circumstances).
I just recently got a box of those tiny "all the electronics in the DB9
molding" types, based on the Cypress "M8" reference platform, and besides
needing to upgrade to 2.6.10rc3 (which meant some quick hand-patching of
my WLAN card driver!), I find that these devices don't work with the
STK500 :((((((( Very sad. So it's back to the Keyspan, which doesn't like
to be inserted on boot ("Badness in...") and chokes occasionally. |
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Grant Edwards
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 3:08 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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On 2004-12-05, Lewin A.R.W. Edwards <larwe@larwe.com> wrote:
| Quote: | I've never had any problem with the $20 USB->serial interfaces
under Linux. Windows support for them isn't great...
Which particular ones are you using? All the devices I've used
either don't work with the evbs I need to use, or cause kernel
panics sometimes (I can't work out the exact circumstances).
|
I've used a couple different no-name "brands" but they were all
based on prolific chips.
The one that I've got handy right now says "micro innovations"
on the DB-9 end. It's the style w/o the lump in the middle.
I've also got another prolific one with a lump in the middle
that plugs into my cell phone. There's one at work with a
different brand that's identical to the "micro innovations"
one.
--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! Yes, Private
at DOBERMAN!!
visi.com |
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Joerg
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 3:12 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Hi Guy,
| Quote: | A laptop or just something small and easy to move around?
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Something light and easy to move around.
| Quote: | Your lab lacks AC outlets?
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No. But when you go to a customer all you usually have is a small corner
and it is more practical to be untethered. Often you have to move from
one prototype to another on the spur of a moment.
| Quote: | Sounds like you want something ruggedized.
|
Ideally, yes. But I don't have the budget of a defense department ;-)
Regards, Joerg
http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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Joerg
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 3:20 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Hi Earl,
| Quote: | I am not sure what it is your after. You want long battery life, rugged case
that doesn't crumble (ruggedized?), doesn't need a lot of CPU power.
Was this a laptop or a ultra compact model? Were you wanting a long battery
life for use outside your lab?
|
It is a Compaq Contura 410 (not the smaller Aero). 12" or so B/W screen
which is all I really ever need. The case cracked all around the
perimeter and it can't run any newer Windows for lack of memory
capacity. Battery life is not the #1 priority but helpful because in
debugging you have to move around quite a bit. And the power outlets are
usually behind a clutter of other gear and tons of cabling.
Just got a flier from Dell for a $599 deal on the Inspiron 1000.
Couldn't find that on the web site but maybe that works as a laptop.
However, battery life ain't great and no RS232 :-(
Regards, Joerg
http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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Joerg
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 3:30 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Hi Tim,
| Quote: | For me, the lab is the penultimate stopping place for desktops before
they become one with the landfill -- why use a laptop at all?
|
Yes, if it were just my lab. But then comes the time where things have
to be tried out at the customer or sometimes in the field. The real
field where the next power pole could be a couple miles behind the
Klondike. Also, you have to fit it all into your carry-on, along with
the nice slacks, shirt and tie for the final presentation to the big guys.
Totally OT: Is there a version of your PID article that has the figures
inside the text? I think that paper is just the ticket to show someone
how feedback works in daily life. Seems they don't learn much of that at
college nowadays.
Regards, Joerg
http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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Klaus Vestergaard Kragelu
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 3:57 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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"Grant Edwards" <grante@visi.com> wrote in message
news:41b386cf$0$9709$a1866201@visi.com...
| Quote: | On 2004-12-05, Lewin A.R.W. Edwards <larwe@larwe.com> wrote:
I've never had any problem with the $20 USB->serial interfaces
under Linux. Windows support for them isn't great...
Which particular ones are you using? All the devices I've used
either don't work with the evbs I need to use, or cause kernel
panics sometimes (I can't work out the exact circumstances).
I've used a couple different no-name "brands" but they were all
based on prolific chips.
The one that I've got handy right now says "micro innovations"
on the DB-9 end. It's the style w/o the lump in the middle.
I've also got another prolific one with a lump in the middle
that plugs into my cell phone. There's one at work with a
different brand that's identical to the "micro innovations"
one.
|
I'm using LabWindows for my serial stuff and have yet to find one that works
flawlessly. I have tried three different types, Prolific, U232-P9 (from
purple computing, http://pfranc.com/usb/usb.mhtml) and a third noname type.
They all had the problem if I setup the program to for example 9600 baud and
wrote several bytes to the comport at a fast sucsession rate it would miss
some bytes and in some cases boot the machine.
The only way I found to make it work, was to add a loop in my program to let
the bytes be written to the comport at or lower than the baudrate. But that
unfortunately means more delay than one would want
And moreover application programs not under my control are not sure to work
since they would probably just write to the port in the normal way
Cheers
Klaus |
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Guy Macon
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:18 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Grant Edwards wrote:
| Quote: | If your lab is in a constant state of being reconfigured, it's
a royal PITA to keep shuffling desktop machines around from one
bench to another.
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PC104 stacks in ruggedized cans are *easier* to shuffle from
one bench to another than laptops are. |
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Grant Edwards
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:42 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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On 2004-12-06, Guy Macon <_see.web.page_@_www.guymacon.com_> wrote:
| Quote: |
Grant Edwards wrote:
If your lab is in a constant state of being reconfigured, it's
a royal PITA to keep shuffling desktop machines around from one
bench to another.
PC104 stacks in ruggedized cans are *easier* to shuffle from
one bench to another than laptops are.
|
And they have keboards and displays?
--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! KARL MALDEN'S NOSE
at just won an ACADEMY AWARD!!
visi.com |
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Guy Macon
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 7:25 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Grant Edwards wrote:
| Quote: |
On 2004-12-06, Guy Macon <_see.web.page_@_www.guymacon.com_> wrote:
Grant Edwards wrote:
If your lab is in a constant state of being reconfigured, it's
a royal PITA to keep shuffling desktop machines around from one
bench to another.
PC104 stacks in ruggedized cans are *easier* to shuffle from
one bench to another than laptops are.
And they have keboards and displays?
|
Mine has a small 640x480 LCD display and a mini-keyboard hooked
to it. I can still tuck the whole system under my arm, and it
takes less benchtop space than any laptop. |
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Tim Wescott
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:06 pm Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Joerg wrote:
| Quote: | Hi Tim,
For me, the lab is the penultimate stopping place for desktops before
they become one with the landfill -- why use a laptop at all?
Yes, if it were just my lab. But then comes the time where things have
to be tried out at the customer or sometimes in the field. The real
field where the next power pole could be a couple miles behind the
Klondike. Also, you have to fit it all into your carry-on, along with
the nice slacks, shirt and tie for the final presentation to the big guys.
Totally OT: Is there a version of your PID article that has the figures
inside the text? I think that paper is just the ticket to show someone
how feedback works in daily life. Seems they don't learn much of that at
college nowadays.
Regards, Joerg
http://www.analogconsultants.com
|
Theoretically ESP magazine owns the rights to that. I need to get off
my fat ass and write another article that I can post with a clear
conscience.
--
Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com |
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Joerg
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Dec 07, 2004 3:33 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Hi Ian,
| Quote: | Whichever one you choose, be sure to check it has a serial interface. Many
laptops these days no longer have one.
|
Actually I was just about to settle for a little Dell this morning.
Then, just before ordering, I found that it doesn't even have a parallel
port. Ouch.
So now I am wondering if an MSP430 tool works via a bidirectional
USB-parallel adapter such as the Micro Innovations USB545C. Else we'd
have to buy the more expensive USB programming pods. I posted a question
on the MSP430 Yahoo forum and to TI support. Let's see.
Regards, Joerg
http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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Rob Young
Guest
|
| Posted:
Tue Dec 07, 2004 5:13 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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|
"Joerg" <notthisjoergsch@removethispacbell.net> wrote in message
news:m75td.29578$zx1.21889@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
| Quote: | Hi Ian,
Whichever one you choose, be sure to check it has a serial interface.
Many
laptops these days no longer have one.
Actually I was just about to settle for a little Dell this morning. Then,
just before ordering, I found that it doesn't even have a parallel port.
Ouch.
So now I am wondering if an MSP430 tool works via a bidirectional
USB-parallel adapter such as the Micro Innovations USB545C. Else we'd have
to buy the more expensive USB programming pods. I posted a question on the
MSP430 Yahoo forum and to TI support. Let's see.
Regards, Joerg
http://www.analogconsultants.com
|
The Dell group that handles leased laptops has an eBay store where they sell
factory reconditioned Dell laptops. I have bought a couple and they seem
quite nice. Not as cheap as you might get a laptop elsewhere but I was
comforted by the fact they have been reworked by Dell technicians.
Perhaps you can find a year or two old model that still has parallel and
serial ports.
http://stores.ebay.com/Dell-Financial-Services_W0QQsspagenameZstrkQ3amefsQ3amesstQQtZkm
If this link doesn't work just go to eBay and search for
"Dell-Financial-Services" and you should eventually end up at their eBay
store.
Rob Young
(no affiliation with Dell, just satisfied with their products) |
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Lewin A.R.W. Edwards
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Dec 07, 2004 5:46 am Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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| Quote: | So now I am wondering if an MSP430 tool works via a bidirectional
USB-parallel adapter such as the Micro Innovations USB545C. Else we'd
have to buy the more expensive USB programming pods. I posted a question
|
I've tried some USB-parallel solutions and none of them worked with the
FET. |
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Paul Burke
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Dec 07, 2004 2:08 pm Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Joerg wrote:
| Quote: |
So now I am wondering if an MSP430 tool works via a bidirectional
USB-parallel adapter such as the Micro Innovations USB545C. Else we'd
have to buy the more expensive USB programming pods. I posted a question
on the MSP430 Yahoo forum and to TI support. Let's see.
|
I don't use one, but I think it's VERY unlikely. The parallel port JTAG
programmers work by direct bit- poking; you'll usually find they come
with an access- protection- defeating driver such as giveio, Port95 etc.
You can program the MSP430s using the serial port, but tyhe debugger
doesn't work that way, you have to revert to old-fashioned LED blinking,
strategically-places printf()s etc.
Paul Burke |
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Joerg
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Dec 07, 2004 5:56 pm Post subject:
Re: Good low cost laptop for embedded work? |
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Hi Lewin,
| Quote: | I've tried some USB-parallel solutions and none of them worked with the
FET.
|
That's sad. It probably is not working for the reasons Paul gave. What
puzzles me is that TI still sells their MSP430 trial kits with a
parallel-only connection with the far end soldered to the proto board.
This means a lot of people with laptops can't use them.
Regards, Joerg
http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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