| Author |
Message |
Skybuck Flying
Guest
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 Posted:
Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:41 pm Post subject:
Maximum clock frequency ? |
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Hi, ;)
I am beginning to understand how CPU's and chip like that work.
I think the clock frequency is very important.
It's almost like the hearbeat of the computer.
It determines how fast the signals change from zero to one and back.
And these signals are what drives the computer.
So I think a very important question would be:
What is the maximum frequency that these kind of "cpu clocks" can provide ?
Other components should ofcourse also be able to handle these high
frequencies.
Like t_flipflops etc :)
So what's the best of the best at the moment ? ;)
Bye,
Skybuck. |
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Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:44 pm Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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Hi Skybuck,
this is a VHDL discussion board ;o)
And not a general information board ;o)
Rgds
André |
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jon@beniston.com
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:11 pm Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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The fastest transistor I've heard of operates at 604 GHz.
Cheers,
Jon |
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Neo
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Aug 02, 2005 3:37 pm Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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jon@beniston.com wrote:
| Quote: | The fastest transistor I've heard of operates at 604 GHz.
Cheers,
Jon
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I thought the Illinois university guys had obtained transistors
operating at 1 Tera Hz . |
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Roger Hamlett
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:15 pm Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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"Skybuck Flying" <nospam@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:dcnbgj$8fr$1@news2.zwoll1.ov.home.nl...
| Quote: | Hi, ;)
I am beginning to understand how CPU's and chip like that work.
I think the clock frequency is very important.
It's almost like the hearbeat of the computer.
It determines how fast the signals change from zero to one and back.
And these signals are what drives the computer.
So I think a very important question would be:
What is the maximum frequency that these kind of "cpu clocks" can
provide ?
Other components should ofcourse also be able to handle these high
frequencies.
Like t_flipflops etc :)
So what's the best of the best at the moment ? ;)
Bye,
Skybuck.
Remember also, that the clock frequency is only one 'part' of the equation |
giving what the system can do. It is effectively multiplied by the 'width'
of the registers, when dealing with numerical values, and also may be
multiplied internally using either a PLL, or short phase delays, so
multiple operations are generated in each clock. you should really think
about the clock, like the speedlimit on a road, with the width of the
registers, being perhaps like the difference between a motorbike, and a
bus, while the internal phase seqencing, acts like having multiple lanes
of traffic running in parallel. In terms of the actual number of people
the road can carry, you have to multiply all these differences together,
but the clocking limits the minimum time a single person can take to
transit part of the road. An internal PLL, acts like a local 'expressway',
reducing this time.
Best Wishes |
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Tim Wescott
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:15 pm Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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Skybuck Flying wrote:
| Quote: | Hi, ;)
I am beginning to understand how CPU's and chip like that work.
I think the clock frequency is very important.
It's almost like the hearbeat of the computer.
It determines how fast the signals change from zero to one and back.
And these signals are what drives the computer.
So I think a very important question would be:
What is the maximum frequency that these kind of "cpu clocks" can provide ?
Other components should ofcourse also be able to handle these high
frequencies.
Like t_flipflops etc :)
So what's the best of the best at the moment ? ;)
Bye,
Skybuck.
Instead of asking all these painfully basic questions and getting |
one-off short answers, perhaps you should go shopping at your local
bookstore or on the web for information on computer architecture?
Trying to get 50,000 words worth of information from random newsgroup
queries is like trying to build a house out of cut-off ends of 2x4
lumber -- and it makes us work at answering questions bit by bit that
are better answered all at once (or at least in much larger chunks).
--
Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com |
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Helmut Sennewald
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:15 pm Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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"Skybuck Flying" <nospam@hotmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:dcnbgj$8fr$1@news2.zwoll1.ov.home.nl...
| Quote: | Hi, ;)
I am beginning to understand how CPU's and chip like that work.
I think the clock frequency is very important.
It's almost like the hearbeat of the computer.
It determines how fast the signals change from zero to one and back.
And these signals are what drives the computer.
So I think a very important question would be:
What is the maximum frequency that these kind of "cpu clocks" can provide
?
Other components should ofcourse also be able to handle these high
frequencies.
Like t_flipflops etc :)
|
Hello Skybuck,
forget T-fliflops. This is the least important part of an
IC-design. I know you read about it in a VHDL intro book,
but they made this just as an example and not because it's
important.
You should really look first for a FPGA design flow,
e.g. www.altera.com , ..., www.xilinx.com.
After you understand that you can look for full costom ICs.
You can buy divider flipflops with 20GHz.
Best regards,
Helmut |
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Skybuck Flying
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:16 pm Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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"Roger Hamlett" <rogerspamignored@ttelmah.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:_AIHe.95$0g7.12@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net...
| Quote: |
"Skybuck Flying" <nospam@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:dcnbgj$8fr$1@news2.zwoll1.ov.home.nl...
Hi, ;)
I am beginning to understand how CPU's and chip like that work.
I think the clock frequency is very important.
It's almost like the hearbeat of the computer.
It determines how fast the signals change from zero to one and back.
And these signals are what drives the computer.
So I think a very important question would be:
What is the maximum frequency that these kind of "cpu clocks" can
provide ?
Other components should ofcourse also be able to handle these high
frequencies.
Like t_flipflops etc :)
So what's the best of the best at the moment ? ;)
Bye,
Skybuck.
Remember also, that the clock frequency is only one 'part' of the equation
giving what the system can do. It is effectively multiplied by the 'width'
of the registers, when dealing with numerical values, and also may be
multiplied internally using either a PLL, or short phase delays, so
multiple operations are generated in each clock. you should really think
about the clock, like the speedlimit on a road, with the width of the
registers, being perhaps like the difference between a motorbike, and a
bus, while the internal phase seqencing, acts like having multiple lanes
of traffic running in parallel. In terms of the actual number of people
the road can carry, you have to multiply all these differences together,
but the clocking limits the minimum time a single person can take to
transit part of the road. An internal PLL, acts like a local 'expressway',
reducing this time.
|
Ok so if this is my clock rate:
111111111111111000000000000000
Can the PLL divide it into:
1111111100000000111111100000000 ? ;)
or maybe even further into ;)
11110000111100001111000011110000 ? ;)
I think that's what it could do/does ?
So the PLL creates a faster clock rate inside the chip ?
Would this mean the "normal" clock is outside of the chip ?
How many real clocks or oscilators(=clock?;)) are there ?
Can the main memory chips and the cpu share the same clock ?
However a transistor is not a clock so my original question is not yet
answered ? ;)
So what's the fastest clock on todays computers and say 5 years from now ?
For my one bit streaming cpu a PLL might not be interesting...
Since I was more thinking of having all the bits stream
across/through/into/out of the cpu directly from main memory ;)
The question is if multiple bits can be transfered in serial over a single
wire with a slower clock frequency and then still be processed by a cpu with
a faster clock frequency... the cpu would have to buffer some bits I guess.
Or something like that... maybe not possible ;) or maybe it would be
possible with bursts.
However... since I don't like all this complexity... (and I dont like bursts
too ;)) I am wondering if my simple cpu will need a clock at all ;)
So just for the kick of it ;)
Can VHDL also be used to design/test circuitry without clocks in them ? ;)
Bye,
Skybuck. |
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Mac
Guest
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| Posted:
Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:25 am Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 01:44:21 -0700, ALuPin wrote:
| Quote: | Hi Skybuck,
this is a VHDL discussion board ;o)
And not a general information board ;o)
Rgds
André
|
Actually, he is cross-trolling to comp.arch, comp.lang.vhdl, and
sci.electronics.design, which is where I'm reading it.
--Mac |
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Bernd Paysan
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Aug 05, 2005 4:15 pm Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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Neo wrote:
| Quote: | I thought the Illinois university guys had obtained transistors
operating at 1 Tera Hz .
|
The fastest transistors seem to be carbon nanotubes, and IIRC, they go well
above 1 THz. The main problem to get real figures is probably the
unsuitable equipment to measure these things. In theory, a carbon nanotube
oscillator should be able to drive a 300nm carbon nanotube dipole, emitting
blue light (now that would be something that's not that hard to measure).
--
Bernd Paysan
"If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
http://www.jwdt.com/~paysan/ |
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JeffM
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Aug 06, 2005 12:15 am Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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| Quote: | I think the clock frequency is very important.
What is the maximum frequency that these kind of "cpu clocks" can provide ?
Skybuck Flying
Instead of asking all these painfully basic questions and getting
one-off short answers, perhaps you should go shopping at your local
bookstore or on the web for information on computer architecture?
Tim Wescott
|
In addition, learning to use a search engine
and finding out how to narrow a search
has an instructive quality all its own.
Here's the one for the sci.electronics.* part of the Usenet Archives:
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups/dir?lnk=gh&sel=33580724 |
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xray
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Aug 06, 2005 8:15 am Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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On Sat, 6 Aug 2005 08:50:59 +0200, "Skybuck Flying" <nospam@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Is something we are all beginning to wish you would take more seriously. |
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Helmut Sennewald
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Aug 06, 2005 8:15 am Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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"Skybuck Flying" <nospam@hotmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:dd1mh0$9bo$1@news4.zwoll1.ov.home.nl...
| Quote: |
"JeffM" <jeffm_@email.com> wrote in message
news:1123281266.100777.106110@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
I think the clock frequency is very important.
What is the maximum frequency that these kind of "cpu clocks" can
provide ?
Skybuck Flying
Instead of asking all these painfully basic questions and getting
one-off short answers, perhaps you should go shopping at your local
bookstore or on the web for information on computer architecture?
Tim Wescott
In addition, learning to use a search engine
and finding out how to narrow a search
has an instructive quality all its own.
Here's the one for the sci.electronics.* part of the Usenet Archives:
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups/dir?lnk=gh&sel=33580724
I am getting a error:
"
Server Error
The server encountered an error and could not complete your request.
If the problem persists, please report your problem and mention this error
message and the query that caused it.
"
Maybe only a temporarely problem.
I still haven't seen any answer to my question... ;)
What's the maximum frequency nowadays ?
Bye,
Skybuck.
|
Hello Skybuck,
you should see a dozen answers to your question if not then
try another news group reader.
Again,
You can achieve 20GHz(20e9Hz) with a T-fliflop.
Other insist they can get 100Tflop.
Now I know why you wanted a design with T(flip)flop.
Maybe this "flip" doubles the Tflop. :)
http://www.hoise.com/primeur/03/articles/live/AE-PL-06-03-5.html
Sorry, I couldn't resist.
A real answer:
A simple processor alone could achieve some GHz, e.g. 10GHz,
but it becomes very expensive and anotrher problem is feeding
such a beast with enough data from memory.
This is then something for an IEEE paper, but nothing which
will make you rich.
Best regards,
Helmut |
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Skybuck Flying
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Aug 06, 2005 8:15 am Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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"Dan Koren" <dankoren@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:42f4635c$1@news.meer.net...
| Quote: |
While one should not in general feed the trolls as a
matter of principle, I will make an exception just to
point out that your question suggests you have not
really thought about the problem in any depth.
What matters most for real circuit design is not the
highest frequency that the clock can generate -- but
rather how far can the clock signal be propagated
reliably and without excessive distortion (distance
and fan-out).
|
Yesssss but maybe the propagation length doesn't matter for a small circuit
like my 1 bit cpu =D
So I would still like to know what the maximum frequency is ;)
And in case the circuit is bigger how do circuits nowadays propagate the
clock signal reliably ;)
Bye,
Skybuck ;) |
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Dan Koren
Guest
|
| Posted:
Sat Aug 06, 2005 8:15 am Post subject:
Re: Maximum clock frequency ? |
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|
While one should not in general feed the trolls as a
matter of principle, I will make an exception just to
point out that your question suggests you have not
really thought about the problem in any depth.
What matters most for real circuit design is not the
highest frequency that the clock can generate -- but
rather how far can the clock signal be propagated
reliably and without excessive distortion (distance
and fan-out).
dk
"Skybuck Flying" <nospam@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:dcnbgj$8fr$1@news2.zwoll1.ov.home.nl...
| Quote: | Hi, ;)
I am beginning to understand how CPU's and chip like that work.
I think the clock frequency is very important.
It's almost like the hearbeat of the computer.
It determines how fast the signals change from zero to one and back.
And these signals are what drives the computer.
So I think a very important question would be:
What is the maximum frequency that these kind of "cpu clocks" can provide
?
Other components should ofcourse also be able to handle these high
frequencies.
Like t_flipflops etc :)
So what's the best of the best at the moment ? ;)
Bye,
Skybuck.
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